California’s AB 412 Still Demands AI Developers Do The Impossible | Techdirt https://www.techdirt.com/ • • Sign In (https://www.techdirt.com/my-account/) • Register (https://www.techdirt.com/register/) • Preferences (https://www.techdirt.com/preferences/) Techdirt - [x] • TechDirt (https://www.techdirt.com/) • GreenHouse (https://www.techdirt.com/edition/greenhouse/) • Free Speech (https://www.techdirt.com/edition/freespeech/) • Error 402 (https://www.techdirt.com/edition/webmonetization/) • Ctrl-Alt-Speech (https://www.techdirt.com/edition/ctrlaltspeech/) • Deals (https://deals.techdirt.com/) • Jobs (https://jobs.techdirt.com/) • Support Techdirt (https://www.techdirt.com/support/) https://www.techdirt.com/blog/podcast/ LAPD Apparently Has Its Own Internal Cop Gang Problem (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/lapd-apparently-has-its-own-internal-cop-gang-problem/) RFK Jr. Talks About How Great A Job He’s Doing Managing The Measles Outbreak (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/rfk-jr-talks-about-how-great-a-job-hes-doing-managing-the-measles-outbreak/) California’s AB 412 Still Demands AI Developers Do The Impossible https://www.techdirt.com/?s&topic=copyright Copyright (https://www.techdirt.com/?s&topic=copyright) from the that's-not-how-any-of-this-works dept Wed, Jun 10th 2026 03:34pm - Joe Mullin (https://www.techdirt.com/user/joe-mullin/) California lawmakers areagain (https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2025/07/california-ab-412-stalls-out-win-innovation-and-fair-use)consideringA.B. 412 (https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billNavClient.xhtml?bill_id=202520260AB412), a bill that would require AI developers to identify and disclose copyrighted works used to train generative AI systems. The problem this year is thesame as last year (https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2025/03/californias-ab-412-bill-could-crush-startups-and-cement-big-tech-ai-monopoly): it’s practically impossible to comply with this law. The bill demands information that often does not exist, and cannot realistically be obtained. EFF submitted anopposition letter (https://www.eff.org/files/2026/06/04/ab_412_may_2026_opp_letter.pdf)to the California Senate Privacy Committee explaining why we continue to believe A.B. 412 is simply unworkable. To the extent developers do follow this law, it will have the effect of locking in the power of the largest companies in AI. A Burden That Can’t Be Met A.B. 412 sounds simple: just have AI developers create and keep a list of all the registered copyrighted works they use in AI training. That may seem straightforward. In practice, it’s anything but. There is no machine-readable “list” of copyrighted works at the U.S. Copyright Office. And many copyright holders can get a copyright without even depositing a publicly viewable sample of the work—for example, software companies may register copyright on proprietary code without revealing it to the public. And on the open internet, copyright information is often incomplete, unavailable, or impossible to verify. One image may be registered with the copyright office, while the next is licensed under a free Creative Commons license (likethe images that EFF creates (https://www.eff.org/copyright)), and the next is public domain. A message forum user might post an original story, photograph, or poem without any indication of ownership or registration status. The bill effectively asks developers to continuously cross-reference massive batches of online data against a copyright system that simply wasn’t designed to do so. If California passes A.B. 412, its impact will go far beyond the large AI companies we read about in the headlines. Not Just Big Tech Supporters often frame this bill as a way to help creative workers have some leverage against Big Tech, but the bill reaches much further than the big AI companies. Its definition of “developer” extends to anyone who makes a generative AI model available to Californians. That includes indie developers tinkering with an existing model, open-source initiatives, nonprofits, and other non-commercial efforts. Recent amendments added exemptions for universities and government entities, which is important, but that still leaves out a vast swathe of non-commercial tech work that’s done by people without full-time jobs in government or academia. Large companies will hire compliance teams and lawyers to navigate these requirements. Smaller organizations and independent developers usually can’t. The result will be fewer opportunities for startups and new entrants. Faced with this massive compliance burden, some won’t even try. Courts Are Already Deciding These Questions The bill is premised on the idea that copyright owners currently don’t have good remedies if they’re mistreated by AI companies. That simply isn’t true. And the growing wave of federal court filings in this space proves it. Content companies that want to sue tech companies, large or small,have no problem doing so (https://chatgptiseatingtheworld.com/aicopyrightcasetracker/).Those courts are still working through important questions about fair use and transformative use. Some courts have already concluded thatmany AI training activities qualify as fair use (https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2025/06/two-courts-rule-generative-ai-and-fair-use-one-gets-it-right). Others continue to evaluate the issue. California lawmakers should not rush to impose new state regulation while those questions remain unresolved. This is why copyright is governed at the federal level: both creators and fair users benefit from a single set of nationwide rules. At this point, the bill remains a solution in search of a problem. Rights holders already have powerful tools to protect their interests under existing federal law. What this bill adds isn’t clarity or transparency, but a costly and essentially impossible compliance burden that will discourage small developers and researchers. California has been able to support both artistic creativity and tech innovation for decades now. But A.B. 412 does not strike the right balance. If you are a California resident and interested in speaking out about this bill, you can find and contact your representativesthrough this website (https://findyourrep.legislature.ca.gov/). Republished from the EFF’s Deeplinks blog (https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2026/06/californias-ab-412-still-demands-developers-do-impossible). Filed Under: ab 412 (https://www.techdirt.com/tag/ab-412/), ai (https://www.techdirt.com/tag/ai/), ai training (https://www.techdirt.com/tag/ai-training/), california (https://www.techdirt.com/tag/california/), copyright (https://www.techdirt.com/tag/copyright/) https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/https://reddit.com/submit?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.techdirt.com%2F2026%2F06%2F10%2Fcalifornias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible%2F&title=California%E2%80%99s%20AB%20412%20Still%20Demands%20AI%20Developers%20Do%20The%20Impossiblehttps://twitter.com/share?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.techdirt.com%2F2026%2F06%2F10%2Fcalifornias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible%2F&text=California%E2%80%99s%20AB%20412%20Still%20Demands%20AI%20Developers%20Do%20The%20Impossible&via=Techdirthttps://www.facebook.com/sharer.php?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.techdirt.com%2F2026%2F06%2F10%2Fcalifornias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible%2F&t=California%E2%80%99s%20AB%20412%20Still%20Demands%20AI%20Developers%20Do%20The%20Impossiblehttps://www.linkedin.com/shareArticle?mini=true&ro=false&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.techdirt.com%2F2026%2F06%2F10%2Fcalifornias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible%2F&title=California%E2%80%99s%20AB%20412%20Still%20Demands%20AI%20Developers%20Do%20The%20Impossible 34 Comments (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comments)Leave a Comment (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comments) If you liked this post, you may also be interested in... • Why Google’s New AI-Saturated Search Page Will Be A Disaster (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/11/why-googles-new-ai-saturated-search-page-will-be-a-disaster/) • CEOs Who Think AI Replaces Their Employees Are Just Bad CEOs (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/09/ceos-who-think-ai-replaces-their-employees-are-just-bad-ceos/) • Meta Admits Its 'AI' Helped Hackers Compromise 20,000 Instagram Accounts (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/09/meta-admits-its-ai-helped-hackers-compromise-20000-instagram-accounts/) • 'Tomb Raider' Remake Developed Using Some AI, Everyone Freaks, Crystal Dynamics Responds, And I'm Confused (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/05/tomb-raider-remake-developed-using-some-ai-everyone-freaks-crystal-dynamics-responds-and-im-confused/) • Ctrl-Alt-Speech: Generous To A Default (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/05/ctrl-alt-speech-generous-to-a-default/) Click to toggle (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/)https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/ Rate this comment as insightful Rate this comment as funny You have rated this comment as insightful You have rated this comment as funny Flag this comment as abusive/trolling/spam You have flagged this comment The first word has already been claimed The last word has already been claimed Comments on “California’s AB 412 Still Demands AI Developers Do The Impossible” Subscribe: RSS (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/comments/feed/)Leave a comment (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#respond) • Filter comments in by Time • Filter comments as Threaded • Filter only comments rated Insightful • Filter only comments rated funny LOL • Filter only comments that are Unread 34 Comments Collapse all replies This comment is new since your last visit. Bloof(profile) (https://www.techdirt.com/user/bloof/)says: June 10, 2026 at 4:20 pm (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5389220) Funny how tech companies can track what advert you looked at on what day, what website, what time, for how many seconds, from what geographical location, using what OS, browser, what plugins you had and how many times you’ve looked at similar things and how many times you’ve clicked through and all those other variables on countless other days… but asking them to make the effort of tracking what material they threw into the slop machine, that’s beyond their ability! That is too much of a burden, you see. Stifling innovation, yadda, yadda. Won’t someone please think of the mom and pop AI startups that may appear at some unspecified point in the future? This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [2] MrWilson(profile) (https://www.techdirt.com/user/mrwilson/)says: June 10, 2026 at 4:57 pm (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5389260) Re: Won’t someone please think of the mom and pop AI startups that may appear at some unspecified point in the future? Except independent LLM developers already exist…? This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [3] Bloof(profile) (https://www.techdirt.com/user/bloof/)says: June 11, 2026 at 12:44 am (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5390104) Re: Re: And if they’re using abusively scraped and stolen data taken without any intent to compensate artists, writers, coders and so on, f-ck, ’em, just like the big boys. This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [4] MrWilson(profile) (https://www.techdirt.com/user/mrwilson/)says: June 11, 2026 at 8:01 pm (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5391951) Re: Re: Re: That means only large corporations and venture-capital-flush startups would be able to afford to develop the systems that are going to dictate your software experience with your insurance, health care, social services, consumer experiences, etc. You’d need to do away with capitalism for that stance to mean anything useful. This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [2] This comment has been deemed insightful by the community. Anonymous Coward says: June 10, 2026 at 9:56 pm (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5389822) Re: Funny how tech companies can track [list of things that tech companies decide to track and then DO track], but asking them to make the effort of tracking [what they’ve already done without tracking], that’s beyond their ability! So… you can track for me what kind of sandwiches you’ve had for lunch, going back the last five years, right? I mean, it’s easy to track, right? This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [3] Anonymous Coward says: June 11, 2026 at 4:52 am (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5390474) Re: Re: I’m not at risk of having committed copyright infringement by making a sandwich in the last five years and not even being concerned enough by the idea to keep track of them. This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [3] Epic_Null(profile) (https://www.techdirt.com/user/epic_null/)says: June 11, 2026 at 7:18 am (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5390787) Re: Re: As my buisness does not depend on my lunch, this data was untracked. I could tell you what dependencies a piece of software had going back that far though. This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [2] This comment has been deemed insightful by the community. Anonymous Coward says: June 10, 2026 at 10:08 pm (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5389842) Re: “It was the best of times, it was the worst of times, it was the age of wisdom, it was the age of foolishness, it was the epoch of belief, it was the epoch of incredulity, it was the season of Light, it was the season of Darkness, it was the spring of hope, it was the winter of despair, we had everything before us, we had nothing before us, we were all going to Heaven, we were all going to Hell.” So tell me… • Was that from the novel? (Public Domain) • The 1958 movie? (copyrighted) • A transcript from the 1938 radio play? (copyrighted by someone else) • From the film “The Only Way”? (copyrighted if ingested prior to 2023, public domain if ingested after) • From “some unidentified source from 1927”? (copyrighted if a sound recording, public domain if a “published source”) Remember, if you get it wrong, the lawyers suing you win. This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [3] Arianity(profile) (https://www.techdirt.com/user/arianity/)says: June 11, 2026 at 3:38 am (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5390355) Re: Re: Remember, if you get it wrong, the lawyers suing you win. I mean, there is a second option- don’t use it if you aren’t sure. Nevermind that the lawyers suing you would also need to know the difference. This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [3] Bloof(profile) (https://www.techdirt.com/user/bloof/)says: June 11, 2026 at 5:31 am (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5390544) Re: Re: Ai companies pretending they either don’t track or can’t track the origins of their training material is not the gotchya you think it is, champ. If they can’t identify where something came from and whether or not they have any legal right to use it, they shouldn’t use it. The world is going to sh-t because of entitled assholes doing crime in bulk and pretending that makes it legal and right, and it’s unfair to them to obey laws that say they should have to obey the laws that were in place when they did the thing in the first place. This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [4] Rocky(profile) (https://www.techdirt.com/user/derocky/)says: June 11, 2026 at 6:05 am (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5390600) Re: Re: Re: Ai companies pretending they either don’t track or can’t track the origins of their training material is not the gotchya you think it is Sure, but it wasn’t really about tracking origins but copyrighted works. Determining if something is copyrighted or not can be very difficult regardless of the origin which some people find to be a very good feature for monetization. Aside from that, just ingesting any kind of content without due diligence is just plain greedy and stupid and those who do that can just fuck off. This comment is new since your last visit. This comment has been deemed insightful by the community. Epic_Null(profile) (https://www.techdirt.com/user/epic_null/)says: June 10, 2026 at 4:23 pm (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5389225) The bill demands information that often does not exist, and cannot realistically be obtained. Why can’t it be obtained, Joe? WHY CAN’T IT BE OBTAINED?! Look. I work with software. You give me any, ANY of our codebases and half an hour, and I will get you at least a shallow dependency list. Give me a day and I can script out some shit to process that into something actually usable. You don’t just shove things in your software and call it a day, developers HAVE A RESPONSIBILITY to manage the Other People’s Work that is included in the final product. And it’s not just us either. I bet if I walked into a resturaunt and asked the owner “Who are your suppliers, you have one day to answer”, they could get me a list of every supplier for a year or point me to the people who could. Hell, there are buisnesses where I could walk in with a product serial number and ask about the source of a specific washer used in the product, and they would be able to point me to the specific LOT that the washer came from. So when I say I have ZERO sympathy for how hard it is to produce the list of worke that they used to train their products, I absolutely mean it. So what if you don’t know “Is this copywritten”?! If you didn’t know then: • you should probably include it in your list • why the hell are you using it if you don’t know its legal status • No seriously what the fuck were you thinking including a dependency you did not bother to understand the legal status of? There is, what I will call, a minumum standard for doing buisness. If you don’t meet that standard, you should not be doing buisness. Being able to answer “How do you source your inputs” is part of that minimum standard. This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [2] terribly tired(profile) (https://www.techdirt.com/user/verymeh/)says: June 11, 2026 at 9:25 am (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5390975) Re: Hell, there are buisnesses where I could walk in with a product serial number[…] Yep. Anyone who manufactures anything remotely complex at anything remotely resembling scale needs this sort of granularity. Even if you yourself don’t ever need any of the information, because your enginerding/proto, production, QA, logistics, and aftermarket depts are all absolutely flawless you might still be contractually bound to be able to provide exactly this sort of info to any number of customers upon request. Contracts and entire relationships are lost over much, much less. This comment is new since your last visit. Anonymous Coward says: June 10, 2026 at 4:32 pm (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5389231) Having a working brain, or, at least, a few working brain cells, has never been a requirement for election to public office. This bill is ample proof! The net effect would be that no AI developers/companies would have a presence in California. All those empty datacenters could be made into living space for the homeless… This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [2] Anonymous Coward says: June 10, 2026 at 11:23 pm (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5389970) Re: So what’s the downside? This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [2] Epic_Null(profile) (https://www.techdirt.com/user/epic_null/)says: June 10, 2026 at 11:36 pm (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5389994) Re: I don’t see how this is a net negative? Essentially California, a highly flammable state on regular water restrictions, would be loosing out on a high-heat, low-employment industry, and thus developers would be able to use the land for… anything else including space for wildlife? This comment is new since your last visit. Anonymous Coward says: June 10, 2026 at 4:46 pm (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5389248) Of COURSE this can be done I run an archive which has over 10 million items in it at the moment and will likely hit 25 million by 2030. I can tell you the provenance and copyright status of every one of them, because — unlike the AI companies — I’ve done everything possible to respect the rights of the people who created those materials, copyright and otherwise. Most of that was accomplished by doing a strange, wonderful, magical thing that you might have heard of: it’s called asking permission. I know, I know, it’s exotic and difficult to grasp, but there you have it. Any of these AI companies could solve this problem almost trivially by putting 1% of their funding into it. If they did so, they would probably be spending thousands of times more than I’m spending doing it — because we’re a nonprofit and can’t spend that much. So, with that much money, they should be able to achieve vastly superior results in much shorter time. But they haven’t and they’re just whining about it either directly or through their well-paid shills — like you. Your entire premise is absolute bullshit. These companies could easily do this, it’s just that they don’t want to. They want to steal, steal, steal. This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [2] Anonymous Coward says: June 10, 2026 at 10:14 pm (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5389855) Re: I have to ask where you find time to read all of the responses to your requests. I mean, 10 million? Whew! If you took 10 seconds per response to read the response, associate it with the item you asked permission for, and hit the “go” button, that’s something like 190 calendar years of work. Where do you find the time? This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [2] Strawb(profile) (https://www.techdirt.com/user/strawb/)says: June 11, 2026 at 12:40 am (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5390091) Re: I could understand the skepticism if this was written by a big tech executive, but it’s coming from an organization that tends to understand the intersection of tech and law. And as he points out, the issue isn’t that the big companies probably couldn’t throw money at the problem to fix it(or get around it); it’s that the small AI developers don’t have the money to throw at the problem. So it would further entrench AI development powers for Big Tech. This comment is new since your last visit. Pixelation says: June 10, 2026 at 4:56 pm (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5389258) Nerd harder baby, just nerd harder! This comment is new since your last visit. This comment has been deemed insightful by the community. Anonymous Coward says: June 10, 2026 at 5:06 pm (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5389274) Nah, fingerprinting and listing all the input material is a trivial task for any developer who has passed compsci 101. There’s nothing hard about it. The only part of the bill that might be problematic for a developer to comply with is “3115.5 (a) (3) Document the rights owner of each covered material documented pursuant to this subdivision.” And since they are only required to make reasonable efforts to identify and document material, this is hardly a meaningful gotcha. The bill effectively asks developers to continuously cross-reference massive batches of online data against a copyright system that simply wasn’t designed to do so. It does not. Including all material used (registered or not) in the disclosure is perfectly compliant with this law. A developer may choose to cross-reference if they wish to keep more of their material secret, but that is a choice they made, not a requirement of the law. At worst, a cottage industry would pop up to produce and sell a mirror of the copyright system which is designed fo this. Which, frankly speaking, is actually the best case scenario as it opens that data to the public in a way which the government currently refuses to do. This comment is new since your last visit. Azuaron says: June 10, 2026 at 5:25 pm (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5389302) Just have the AI do it Just have the AI do it. That’s what they’re promising, right? A machine that can do anything, replace anyone? They should put their money where their mouths are: just have the AI do it. This comment is new since your last visit. This comment has been deemed insightful by the community. Arianity(profile) (https://www.techdirt.com/user/arianity/)says: June 10, 2026 at 5:45 pm (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5389318) it’s practically impossible to comply with this law. The bill demands information that often does not exist, and cannot realistically be obtained. Not really sure why that’s our problem that their model of indiscriminately scraping isn’t viable. Something that anyone wanting to use large amounts of copyrighted works would have to deal with as well. Large companies will hire compliance teams and lawyers to navigate these requirements. You just said it wasn’t possible. If it’s actually impossible, it’s not something you can simply throw compliance teams and lawyers at. Smaller organizations and independent developers usually can’t. Content companies that want to sue tech companies, large or small, have no problem doing so. The U.S. legal system is famously expensive and unavailable for smaller litigants, a point you yourself are literally making in this article, and something EFF is well aware of. It’s also not just content companies who have copyright protections- it’s smaller organizations and independent creators, too. Rights holders already have powerful tools to protect their interests under existing federal law. And yet, you couldn’t give a single resolved example actually doing so. Never mind that EFF likely wouldn’t support any such decision if it were actually resolved in favor of rights holders in the first place. This comment is new since your last visit. Boba Fatt(profile) (https://www.techdirt.com/user/wfrichar/)says: June 10, 2026 at 9:15 pm (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5389748) EVERYTHING is copyrighted Under US law and most other countries (Berne Convention) nearly every work gets a copyright as soon as it’s created. The copyright owner – which is not necessarily the author – has the right to control who can make copies, display the work, make derivative works, etc. Most of the outraged replies saying the EFF is wrong include quotes from the first post. THAT QUOTED TEXT IS COPYRIGHTED. By posting those quotes, you’re using someone else’s copyrighted content. The US has fair use exceptions, but many other countries don’t, and even in the US that’s only useful as a defense in a lawsuit – it’s not a right in itself. Who owns the copyright on those quotations? The EFF? Techdirt? Someone else? Has the owner of the EFF’s statements granted permission for Joe Mullin or Techdirt to post them in the article? Can Techdirt grant permission for commenters here to quote it further? Have I granted permission for THIS post to be quoted? That’s the problem. Sure, automate that fact-finding process for every single thing on the web. I’ll wait. Yes, AI scrapers are jerks and they’re abusing long-standing social conventions in ways that are actively harmful. Techdirt has posted multiple articles about that. But now it’s bad enough to trigger the politician’s syllogism, which makes it even worse. That’s what the EFF is opposing. This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [2] Anonymous Coward says: June 10, 2026 at 10:29 pm (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5389884) Re: “Most of the outraged replies saying the EFF is wrong include quotes from the first post. THAT QUOTED TEXT IS COPYRIGHTED. By posting those quotes, you’re using someone else’s copyrighted content.” Of course we/they are. And of course this is fair use under copyright law, because we’re merely quoting a very small portion of it for reference. You know this full well, you’re just pretending that you don’t. “Sure, automate that fact-finding process for every single thing on the web. I’ll wait.” While I’m certain that this is well beyond your feeble abilities, it’s not beyond those of others: it’s just a matter of having enough money to fund the resources required to do it. And every single one of these AI companies has enough money to do this thousands of times over — and they certainly have enough computing capacity and staff to do it. In other words, you’re lying about the difficulty of the problem in order to make it seem intractable. It’s not. This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [2] Simple says: June 10, 2026 at 11:35 pm (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5389990) Re: That makes the list very easy, just put every item on it individually This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [2] Epic_Null(profile) (https://www.techdirt.com/user/epic_null/)says: June 10, 2026 at 11:54 pm (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5390029) Re: Thing is, for something like a comment on the article, everything is “Reasonably Cited” – by which I mean if I quoted your quote, and someone had just the RSS feed entry of my quoting your quote, the author would be quickly discovered. The law as described in the article is only asking companies to “identify and disclose copyrighted works”, which could easily be done in the case of quoting a quote of a quote. You would simply cite where you got it from and pass along relevant citations from where you got it from, referencing all relevant authors as impacted copyright holders. After all, the message containing the quote is a derivative work. Sure, automate that fact-finding process for every single thing on the web. I’ll wait. Well… it’s probably doable anywhere that consented to be used for AI training. But you’re right about it not being practical everywhere. Which IMO is an argument that said content should not be used in the first place. Our laws should not be written to protect “jerks […] abusing long-standing social conventions in ways that are actively harmful” from the consequences of their failure to have common decency. This comment is new since your last visit. Diogenes(profile) (https://www.techdirt.com/user/adamrussell/)says: June 10, 2026 at 10:03 pm (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5389835) compromise Have them keep a list of works they know damn well are copyrighted. This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [2] This comment has been deemed insightful by the community. Anonymous Coward says: June 10, 2026 at 10:31 pm (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5389896) Re: If you’re not considering edge cases, you’re not answering the problems with a law that does not recognize edge cases. So, just for instance: If the work was under copyright when it was ingested, but is public domain now, what happens? This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [3] Anonymous Coward says: June 11, 2026 at 7:05 am (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5390757) Re: Re: It gets disclosed as ‘potentially copyrighted’ to coya. obviously. Try a harder one. This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [3] Epic_Null(profile) (https://www.techdirt.com/user/epic_null/)says: June 11, 2026 at 7:10 am (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5390771) Re: Re: Work Name: Copyright date-date. Public domain as of date. This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [4] Strawb(profile) (https://www.techdirt.com/user/strawb/)says: June 11, 2026 at 7:52 am (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5390853) Re: Re: Re: And if there’s no record, or worse, conflicting records of those dates? This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [5] Epic_Null(profile) (https://www.techdirt.com/user/epic_null/)says: June 11, 2026 at 8:29 am (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5390889) Re: Re: Re:2 Then either the company should have the records to back the dates they chose to use, or someone failed to do their due dilligance before using the works for commercial purposes, and the company should be in trouble. This comment is new since your last visit. Threaded [3] Anonymous Coward says: June 11, 2026 at 5:40 pm (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#comment-5391707) Re: Re: If they are unsure of the copyright status, they can simply include it in the dataset. The law does not require that the dataset only includes registered copyrighted material, it requires that all such material is in the dataset. Including any material they are unsure of, or just including all material they used without even attempting to check the status, is perfectly compliant. Close • says: https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/# Add Your Comment Cancel reply (https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#respond) Your email address will not be published.Required fields are marked * Have a Techdirt Account? Sign in now (https://www.techdirt.com/my-account/?redirect_to=https://www.techdirt.com/2026/06/10/californias-ab-412-still-demands-ai-developers-do-the-impossible/#respond). Want one? Register here (https://www.techdirt.com/register/) Name Email • Subscribe to the Techdirt Daily (https://listserv.techdirt.com/cgi-bin/dada/mail.cgi/list/techdirt/) newsletter URL Subject Comment * Comment Options: Use markdown (https://commonmark.org/help/). Use plain text. 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(https://.../?utm_source=&utm_medium=js-dealfeed&utm_content=&utm_campaign=) Techdirt Insider Discord The latest chatter on the Techdirt Insider Discord channel... • Leah Abram:To install a data center? I think that’s a horrifying possibility but something we must prepare for. • BentFranklin:They will not be stopped. They flout all laws and regulations. • aabsurdity:They will be stopped. • They're simply choosing to escalate rather than retreat. It will not end well for them. • Leah Abram:In lighter stories • I just found out that there's fan-fiction of The Maltese Falcon that actually resolves the story with closure: https://www.amazon.com/Return-Ma...https://www.amazon.com/Return-Maltese-Falcon-Allan-Collins/ (https://www.amazon.com/Return-Maltese-Falcon-Allan-Collins/) • I The Public Domain! • BentFranklin:If Trump runs for a third term let's nominate Obama to run against him. • Leah Abram:[[gifv]https://tenor.com/view/do-it-star-wars-emperor-palpatine-palpatine-gif-7523581979863470761](https://tenor.com/view/do-it-star-wars-emperor-palpatine-palpatine-gif-7523581979863470761) • BentFranklin:Trump Tower Tehran: you heard it here first • tomacamot:I wish I hadn't • candescence:So the judge for that $10b IRS Trump case agreed to reopen it. • https://thehill.com/regulation/c...https://thehill.com/regulation/court-battles/5902065-trump-irs-lawsuit-reopened/ (https://thehill.com/regulation/court-battles/5902065-trump-irs-lawsuit-reopened/) • imatool13:I imagined all roads would lead to this anyway, just didn't assume this quickly. • John Roddy:Not quite • More like dragging the plaintiff back into court to explain • aabsurdity:Bluesky's new moderation system silencing entire accounts for posting adult content is pretty bleak. :( • https://bsky.app/profile/did:plc...https://bsky.app/profile/did:plc:34ydeurdtukrpzjjelklch4y/post/3mn5p4mttas22 (https://bsky.app/profile/did:plc:34ydeurdtukrpzjjelklch4y/post/3mn5p4mttas22)https://bsky.app/profile/teethgr...https://bsky.app/profile/teethgrip.bsky.social/post/3mn4kej3ctk2q (https://bsky.app/profile/teethgrip.bsky.social/post/3mn4kej3ctk2q) • John Roddy:All right, so who's going to be the one to write about Clarence Thomas's blog post in today's order list? • That last paragraph is just too perfect • intelati:What. What a cursed sentence/timeline • https://bsky.app/profile/mjsdc.b...https://bsky.app/profile/mjsdc.bsky.social/post/3mna7cn7lpc2j (https://bsky.app/profile/mjsdc.bsky.social/post/3mna7cn7lpc2j) • Oh. • aabsurdity:Thomas evidently spending so much time wearing his klan hood, nobody's had the heart to tell him he's black... • Mike Masnick:there was that biographer of thomas who says he's actually never given up his black radical past, but believes that the only way for Black radicalism to succeed is to remove any and all attempts to help the Black community so that they have to do it entirely on their own. A kind of accelerationist argument • John Roddy:This is why I tell people they're missing the point when they suggest that he's reaching for another Plessy v Fergusson • Nah. More like Prigg v Pennsylvania. • candescence:https://bsky.app/profile/justinb...https://bsky.app/profile/justinbaragona.bsky.social/post/3mnaqomeegc26 (https://bsky.app/profile/justinbaragona.bsky.social/post/3mnaqomeegc26) • Yeah, ngl this is legitimately an ass-backwards change that defeats the point of putting content filters in the hands of users and kinda punishes users for correctly marking posts as NSFW https://bsky.app/profile/chocomi...https://bsky.app/profile/chocomingo.bsky.social/post/3mmz2dycdjk2v (https://bsky.app/profile/chocomingo.bsky.social/post/3mmz2dycdjk2v) • Leah Abram:Agreed. Bluesky enshittified itself. • (I don't know if Mr. C. Doctorow would agree with my usage of that term, though) • John Roddy:They already started rolling it back • Leah Abram:Wait, what? BlueSky disenshittified themselves? • John Roddy:They seemed to be genuinely shocked by the backlash. • I don't understand how • Leah Abram:So Trumpy rolled back his $1.8B IRS scam and BlueSky walked back their enshittifying changes? • Am I feeling…pride? • [[gifv]https://klipy.com/gifs/what-nani-1](https://klipy.com/gifs/what-nani-1) • John Roddy:Mamdani suspended bedtimes • candescence:Must've been a well-intentioned change that the staff really did not think through • But they really should stop with these sudden changes without community input • John Roddy:That's what gets me. BlueSky is one of the very few startups that genuinely took moderation and trust& safety serious from day one • How did they walk into such an obvious backlash like this? • aabsurdity:There were reports that one of the people affected was given a 22 day timer, shown on posts. Because your entire post history dissolves into chastity after 22 days somehow, I guess? • Bluesky moderation has stepped on a few rakes, but this really scared the whole artist community, given all the NSFW and SFW creators whose lives and livelihoods were decimated by PayPal in recent months. • https://bsky.app/profile/safety....https://bsky.app/profile/safety.bsky.app/post/3mnb7cza5yc2g (https://bsky.app/profile/safety.bsky.app/post/3mnb7cza5yc2g) I really could do without the idea that the concept of humans having bodies is inherently harmful to people until they turn 18. • Generations of kids have been taught how to deal with being on fire, but nobody wants to have a talk with their kids about other people because it's icky. • benv0727:Today, I joined @IJM to call for the Senate to immediately hold a vote on my STOP CSAM Act—which advanced unanimously out of the Senate Judiciary Committee. Children need protections from predators on the internet, and this bill is an essential first step. There is no more time for delay. • https://x.com/i/status/206185715...https://x.com/i/status/2061857154957468115 (https://x.com/i/status/2061857154957468115) • aabsurdity:If you're quoting someone, it's generally accepted that you will use quote marks to indicate this. • BentFranklin:Microsoft CEO: We’re moving from OS and apps to agents instead • https://9to5mac.com/2026/06/02/m...https://9to5mac.com/2026/06/02/microsoft-ceo-were-moving-from-os-and-apps-to-agents-instead/ (https://9to5mac.com/2026/06/02/microsoft-ceo-were-moving-from-os-and-apps-to-agents-instead/) • . • Mike Masnick:at some point i'm going to write something about this, but an agentic-first computing paradigm really would fuck up all the efforts to age gate the internet... so I get why people don't like it for the AI of it all, but there are some interesting side effects • John Roddy:I know it usually misses the point to investigate how it would break once it's been established that the break is inevitable. But hey, that's still fascinating to weirdos like me. • Also, Matt Taibbi is appealing his defamation loss to the 2nd Circus. • Get in, losers. We're going losing! • candescence:https://bsky.app/profile/yashara...https://bsky.app/profile/yasharali.bsky.social/post/3mndxlp273d2g (https://bsky.app/profile/yasharali.bsky.social/post/3mndxlp273d2g) • https://bsky.app/profile/justinb...https://bsky.app/profile/justinbaragona.bsky.social/post/3mndxll2mvk2l (https://bsky.app/profile/justinbaragona.bsky.social/post/3mndxll2mvk2l) • Nick Bilton is a thin-skinned stooge. • Mike Masnick:meanwhile... [[video]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=36jxNeV5L1Q](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=36jxNeV5L1Q) • aabsurdity:https://www.youtube.com/shorts/3...https://www.youtube.com/shorts/3fS5NyKzygU (https://www.youtube.com/shorts/3fS5NyKzygU) • Seems to be a decent summary. • Leah Abram:I concur. • imatool13:@Mike Masnick with the prolifieration of Agents is MCP (mixed with skills) protocol above platform? Seems a whole lot of companies open themselves up to AI Agents more than just integrations, curious your thoughts. • BentFranklin:I didn't think we were ever going to get the Musk versus Zuckerberg slapfight we were promised, but now that we will have a cage right there, it would be wasteful not to use it at least a few more times before dismantling it. • aabsurdity:Especially now that Trump wants to keep it forever as a commemoration of his bestest and happiest birthday, like the Eiffel Tower. • intelati:What the [[article]https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2026/06/03/trump-ufc-arena-white-house-claw-permanent/90387950007/](https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2026/06/03/trump-ufc-arena-white-house-claw-permanent/90387950007/) I hate this timeline • aabsurdity:It's amazing how Trump does not, and never has, and never will, have any class whatsoever. He genuinely cannot see the difference between the engineering marvel of the Eiffel Tower, and a commonplace (though still a significant technical achievement in its way) lighting scaffold. They're both made of metal. • BentFranklin:How long until his ballroom guests mosey over after dinner to watch gladiators fight to the death with Trump having the final say with or ? • aabsurdity:I can't imagine he'd be interested. He'd have to be able to care if people other than himself are alive or dead. • intelati:Not this bout. The next one is a 50/50 shot. And increasing therein • BentFranklin:You know how mobsters will make you do a crime before they can trust you? So they will always have something on you? I think about that whenever someone says "I was just Epstein's lawyer," or broker, or anything significant. • John Roddy:I someone describe the BAM article as "climbing Mount Masnick" • And my brain immediately did the movie trailer guy voice for "from the makers of Driving Ms Daisy" • Leah Abram:Maybe it’s because of where I live but when I see “BAM” I think “Brooklyn Academy of Music” • aabsurdity:[[link]https://fxbsky.app/profile/presidentkelly.blacksky.app/post/3mnkf25iyjs2s](https://fxbsky.app/profile/presidentkelly.blacksky.app/post/3mnkf25iyjs2s)[[article]https://fxbsky.app/profile/yeti-detective.bsky.social/post/3mnkhrida222h](https://fxbsky.app/profile/yeti-detective.bsky.social/post/3mnkhrida222h) AI hiring screeners apparently retaining their rejection score for applicants across multiple different jobs, at all the companies they service, for nearly a year. So, get rejected for one job, basically you're unhireable by any company that also uses that tool, for any position, for the next 330 days. That's... Pretty dang bad if true... • BentFranklin:The Smart TV in Your Living Room Is a Node in the AI Scraping Economy • [[article]https://blog.includesecurity.com/2026/06/the-smart-tv-in-your-livingroom-is-a-node-in-the-aiscraping-economy/](https://blog.includesecurity.com/2026/06/the-smart-tv-in-your-livingroom-is-a-node-in-the-aiscraping-economy/) • Leah Abram:This is why Dumb TVs are a smart option! • I want a TV dumber than Pete Hegseth! • tomacamot:Or simply don't connect your TV to the Internet • candescence:Scott Pelley is now free to shit on his former bosses and tell the world how much of a propaganda rag CBS is becoming: https://youtu.be/ePqdmbgQ4BI?si=...https://youtu.be/ePqdmbgQ4BI?si=DZq7rY81Ur9IcKUt (https://youtu.be/ePqdmbgQ4BI?si=DZq7rY81Ur9IcKUt) • Quotes include "Bari Weiss Emailed my Boss and asked 'Can you make the protestors look more violent?'" and "Can you describe Renee Good as 'driving at the officer'?" • This is why you don't fire people who know where the bodies are buried. • aabsurdity:Someone said something today that I genuinely hadn't considered, which was the idea that this isn't an anti-journalism conservative deliberately torching a journalistic institution because the money they're spending doesn't mean anything any more, or that the death of CBS is simply advantageous, and instead that this is a project someone believes in and thinks it's going to work. And I have to admit that I didn't even see that as a possibility, but now that I have, that might make it worse. • Mike Masnick:Oh, they absolutely believe it's going to work. The Bari Weisses of the world believe fully that their view of the world has a silent majority behind them who were just waiting to have what The Free Press was delivering to the world... • aabsurdity:Genuinely baffling. • intelati:https://bsky.app/profile/cdelawa...https://bsky.app/profile/cdelawalla.bsky.social/post/3mnrigweehc2t (https://bsky.app/profile/cdelawalla.bsky.social/post/3mnrigweehc2t) • candescence:It looks like Microsoft and Sony's gaming divisions have almost entirely reverted back to exclusivity • Leah Abram:The golden age is over. This is like when Comedy Specials went from DRM-free video files to being included with streaming services • candescence:Sony's pulling back from single-player PC releases is a bit more questionable since low sales there are kinda self-inflicted due to late but overpriced releases, but the Xbox division has a new boss and it seems she's decided that multiplatform releases simply aren't working and are hurting the brand • timothygeigner:Trust me, the exclusivity thing is on my radar. I definitely have things to say about it. • Though why Microsoft won't just admit that they lost the console wars is beyond me. • John Roddy:My favorite was the clarification that the new Gears of War would be exclusive to Xbox. • And PC. • The ol' Ubisoft-style definition of exclusive. • aabsurdity:As a PC gamer... • BentFranklin:Landmark German ruling declares Google's AI Overviews are Google's own words and makes it liable for false answers • [[article]https://the-decoder.com/landmark-german-ruling-declares-googles-ai-overviews-are-googles-own-words-and-makes-it-liable-for-false-answers/](https://the-decoder.com/landmark-german-ruling-declares-googles-ai-overviews-are-googles-own-words-and-makes-it-liable-for-false-answers/) Become an Insider! 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